Saturday, April 21, 2007

It's enough to drive someone crazy...

Meg has written an an excellent post about Alec Baldwin's outburst to his child. No one, including me, likes to see such an outburst against a child, but there are some contributory factors that must be understood. Baldwin has been fighting for his daughter for 6 years, you can bet he feels more guilt then anyone could lay on him. Someone described it very well, it builds up like a volcano.

You can read it here:
Any female who is being honest...
I caught part of this news because of Meg's post, and I must compliment Meg on her understanding of a very poorly understood problem. I would say that no one, and I mean no one, who has not experienced this first hand could possibly understand the anger and frustration that PAS and child custody games can have on someone. I am surprised how well Meg has understood this problem. As bad as my situation is, at least my son is not being turned against me.

My wife insists she wants me to have a relationship with my son. She has been very convincing to the court who parrot what she says followed by a big “But”, It amazes me how gullible the court is in such a transparent control play.

My wife is using my son as leverage against me in court. She's preventing him from seeing me to increase pressure on me, to gain concessions from me, to get vengeance on me, and to be in control. She, being overprotective, does criticize my parenting to the court to gain support for the lower than minimum visitation, that I now have.

The courts and the media take things out of context, overreact and in a misguided effort to protect the child they in fact aid in the abuse of the child. I have nearly been bankrupted in 2 years of child custody litigation. I have attempted to shorten the case in every way possible, but an abusive lawyer is extending the case. When an angry wife makes an accusation, it is assumed true, regardless of how outrageous and the Father's rights are taken away until he can prove himself innocent.

As any reader of my Blog knows, this takes a tremendous toll, especially over time. For the first six months, I was able to handle this just fine. After the first last-minute Christmas visitation denial attempt it started to get to me. My Blog starts at the 18th month so you see things after they have had plenty of time to build up.

In Baldwin's case, with more money, come more games. He has been screwed with for 6 years. But it's really not just him, it's his daughter. It is important that when talking of these child custody games, the child always looses. Baldwin's words sound terrible, inexcusable, impossible to understand.

That's because, until you've had the court interfere with your relationship to your child thanks to your ex, you can not understand the level of anger and frustration. I have been in my share of battles, and I can take plenty. But to see my son cowering behind me screaming and crying, pleading and begging to stay just a little longer, while his mother tries to tug him away, is something that pushes your emotions far beyond the worst adult argument you can think of. Despite that I remained as outwardly calm as possible (although inwardly furious) as I asked my wife if I could have 5 or 10 minutes to calm him down and bring him to her apartment. NO NO NO! She needs to be in control, best interest of my son be damned. Would 10 minutes matter, to her it would mean loss of control. To my son, his frustration could have been calmed down. Which is more important?

I put his interests first, she puts her desires first. We're different.

When my son repeatedly asks to see me and the biased Guardian refuses to grant that request. Then after all the hurdles the Guardian put up, the opposition extorts me to sign an agreement with even more restrictions or loose Christmas visitation. When the bias Guardian saw the extra restrictions she told the judge that it was disgusting, what did the judge do? Nothing! So the judge took the adversarial oppositions view rather than the mother biased Guardian (who's supposed to consider mother/father/child). So if the judge was going to use the most restrictive visitation recommended by my wife's lawyer, why was a (supposedly unbiased) Guardian appointed? More fees?

I understand Baldwin's phone frustration, because of my very limited visitation, I too have an order granting me phone access. My wife always puts it on speaker phone, listens in, and on occasion has cut our call short. My son is older now and occasionally has been so frustrated that he asked her to let him talk to his father privately. I have to adjust my schedule in order to take advantage of the phone contact and sometimes she doesn't allow it. After changing my schedule or creating quite an inconvenience, I'm denied my court ordered right.

I remember one of my co-workers commenting when I worked overtime and couldn't get home before the scheduled call. So there I was sitting outside the data center with my phone reading "20,000 Leagues Under the Sea" to my son. He stopped and marveled at my perseverance in maintaining a relationship with my son, despite the restrictions. He asked me, how is it that they don't understand how much you love your son and how terribly wrong this restricted visitation is?

Compared to Baldwin, I'm lucky, my relationship with my son is undamaged despite my wife and the court using him as a pawn in their hurtful, deceitful game that they justify "in the best interest of the child". But I do understand his frustration, mine is directed at the court, the officers of the court and the system, rather than my child. I am criticized for my justified frustration. I was ejected from judges chambers for stating that using my son as leverage was child abuse. The truth hurts.

These are just words. Meg has also written good words. But words are so limited in their ability to explain something so complex.

What Baldwin said was wrong, and no one is more pained then he is that things have gotten so bad. But something caused it, and that is wrong, and that's what we should be talking about.

If you haven't lived it, you will have difficulty understanding it and you should thank God for that.

20 comments:

Meg Kelso said...

I think anyone who's being honest will say that they've seen women act like this. Maybe a few people have avoided them, but the nutty women have families that are as easily controlled by the mother as is the father...wjhy in the HELL don't they say anything to the wacko females who do this.

JQ,

Your ex is using cash everytime you guys go to court. That's not free. It's either costing the taxpayers or your son and all for what? For a nuts' desire to be a bitch.

OOOOHH!!! It makes me so angry! You're post makes me want to put the article that I wrote up on my blog....I'm gonna do that now.

Thanks for the kind words and good luck with your son. It does end...all you can do is sit back, be sure to be there when he comes looking for you and don't speak badly about his mother. I was doing that to my son once, I was actually angry at him because he couldn't see what his father had done. The look of pain in his eyes was too much to bear...I never did that again. Your skank will be sorry, I just hope it doesn't affect your so too badly.

Meg

JQ75 said...

It certainly does cost my son, taxpayers, and so many more. The impact, the ripple effect.

As many of my posts imply, the system encourages this, it feeds on people who aren't thinking clearly, like a parasite feeds on a host.

The pain for the children is indeed the worst of it all.

Thanks for the new post on your Blog.

Red Wine and Chocolate said...

Hi JQ, Mama J here, I finally signed up for blogger and will start mine up soon.

I saw Meg's post first and then read yours and I wholeheartedly agree with you both. My brother would have been in the same position you are if not for his ex being a complete and utter simpleton.

She got angry at him right after he moved out, went to his apartment, barged in the door and when he calmly asked her to leave or he would call the cops, she then yanked the phone cord out of the wall.

That is "interfering with a 911 call" in my state and is grounds for a DV arrest, and he called the cops on his cell. It was one of the hardest things he ever did. The cops gave him shit about it, my teenage niece was devastated, My young nephews were confused and my brother felt horrible.

But it was the right thing to do. She had crossed the line many times before and he never reported it. This incident gave him the upper hand in their divorce and he was very fair to his ex with thier settlement, he arranged custody to HIS liking -ALL PRO SE - no attorneys for either. I thought he was insane but reading your story JQ he was a mental giant. My ex SIL is still primary custodial parent as he travels extensively for his work) but he sees them as often as he and they like and he eventually ended up with his house back (long story involving Credit Card Fraud by the EX against my brother)

The kids leave for school every day from his house, he works at home when he isn't on the road. My Ex SIL has NEVER abused her kids and by all accounts a good mom (I've known her half my life). My brother being in control of the divorce nearly sent her over the edge and none of us trust my now 16 y/o niece as she is her mothers eyes and ears and reports everything back to mom. We are very careful of our conversations around her.

I keep telling my brother to hang in there with my niece, I was on the receiving end of parental manipulation. My dad had me convinced me when I was 10 that my mother was an evil bitch. However, there was an incident that opened my eyes when I was TWELVE YEARS OLD, when I was able to put the pieces together and realized that NOTHING my dad did was in my best interest, it was just a giant FUCK YOU to my mom.

Talk about an epiphany. I felt like a complete asshole. I had treated my mother terribly and she never ever deserved that

I love my dad, but have never trusted him again. He was hurt a few years back when I told him that he would not be my kids guardian if something should happen to my husband and I.

He was never in it for my best interested, why would I trust him to take care of my kids?

Sorry this was kind of rambling, but I can't imagine doing this kind of thing to my kids, my boys absolutely adore thier dad and would despise me for the rest of thier lives if I tried to keep them from him.

Anonymous said...

Read your posts over and count how many times you talk about your feelings, your wants and your needs.
Narcissm at it's finest.
You have chosen the martyr role.
You get off on the fight.
If you had agrred to provide a living wage to your child..that is child support and agreed to some basic ground rules you would have an adult mature relationship but you couldn't. Because you are a martyr horribly wronged.
Try just giving in, stop fighting.
Every time you engage with your lunatic ex you hand her ammuntion. If you stop she has to because she wont have anyone to play with anymore.

It takes two dysfunctional people to create such a mess. How about you try on a new persona? Try being the one that doesn't want to fight anymore?
Don't give me that martyrs whine about how your dear son will feel abandoned..your dear son will be so damn relieved that the fighting has stopped he will love you for it.
Tell him why you are stopping the court fight, explain that you don't want to make his mother unhappy, you only want him to be happy.
Every time you start or respond to a fight your son pays for it..your loony ex has only one person she can dump on and that is your kid.
Take it from someone who lived through two ridiculous asshole parents who couldn't stop telling everyone they were only doing this because they loved their kid while making said kid miserable with the never ending fight.
i hate both my parents now and I haven't spoken to them in twenty years. Just because they loved me soooo much.

JQ75 said...

Well annon, just a few comments.

You apparently haven't read enough.
You're a chicken shit for being anon.
You make hurtful and false allegations.

Living wage for my son? My child support for one child is the same as my mortgage and 3 times the amount a friend of mine pays for 3 children.

You must be God like if you can talk about other peoples feelings with authority. I don't have that supernatural power so I confine my discussions to my own feelings.

My wife wants SOLE CUSTODY WITH NO SET VISITATION. Again you speak from ignorance. If I stop I will not see my son. That is not acceptable. She times my visitation to the minute and often shorts me.

I don't "get off" on the fight. It's killing me.

Your situation is different than mine. So after I got done explaining my stop fighting to him, that would be the last I'd see of him.

I'm tolerant of a varity of views, but not name calling, deliberate attacks, or accusations without facts.

To my regular readers, I think I should delete this post. Give me your thoughts on this post and deleting it.

Determined said...

No, don't delete it. Anonymous sounds as if he's speaking strictly through his own experience.

I highly doubt that this person has been reading your blog since the beginning.

I don't think any harm was intended although this person sure has a lot of misplaced anger.

JQ75 said...

Mama J, welcome back.

When I fired my lawyer, I forced the judge to accept me as Pro Se, because for 6 months the lawyers were playing games with over $15,000 (2.5 years) of child support. I had already signed off for it to be paid, but the hired bitch decided my not accepting it, she could get me labeled as a deadbeat and destroy my credit. This was deliberate harassment meant to wear me down and give away all custody and visitation as they wanted.

When I was finally admitted Pro Se, I saw the merry go round unsubstantiated accusation game they were playing. I came prepared, I presented evidence and challenged them to hold my employer in contempt since they supplied the same inffo. I resolved 6 of 8 motions in 30 minutes. The judge was impressed and knows me by name to this day.

But he does not believe in Pro Se and denied me from continuing to represent myself. This is actually illegal and may be a problem for him in the future (reversible error).

As I've said, even in this post, my wife uses my son as a weapon, but just in court. So our son doesn't see the two of us fighting or bad mouthing one another. But he does see that he isn't allowed to visit me. For his well being, I blame it on the court.

To some extent it is the court's fault because they shouldn't allow her to deny me visitation or put up with her lawyer's games.

But ultimately, my wife is free to let my son visit as often as she wants. She has chosen not to. So she is to blame, I just don't tell my son that.

But it won't take long for him to ask the question, Can't Mommy let me come over without the court's permission? His school has a children's divorce support group and he's going to hear it from somebody.

JQ75 said...

Sol, he is speaking of his experiences and that part is OK.

But he is also acting as if they apply to me and he's using a rude tone, that is not appreciated.

He can express his own experiences and concerns without making ignorant personal accusations.

Lara said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Lara said...

I say it's YOUR blog and you don't have to post any postings that you don't want too. I don't LOL
Which must be why Colon and Karen don't bother abusing/commenting me on there.

mt_detroit said...

Anon has pent of frustration, and hasn't read your blog well enough to know your story.

or anon knows all of us and is trying to be mean to you.

Either way just ignore it.

guttergirl said...

I wouldn't delete the comment. Leave it there. Anyone who wants to post that kind of vile, angry,diatribe should be brave enough to leave a name.

I feel you are doing what you feel is best for your child. You want to stay a part of his life and are fighting to be a part of his life. In later years, I am sure he will be glad you fought so hard to be his Dad.

If you gave up the fight, you would lose all contact with him. Your ex would make sure of it. I am sure she would also make sure to poison him against you. Never give up that fight.

Anonymous said...

Lara looking fer somthing?

JQ75 said...

To Anon's - I'm debating over removing hostile comments. This last one is odd, on the surface it could be a friendly tease.

But If I see anon's using my Blog to attack others, you'll be deleted immediately. Period.

I opened Anon access by request as a convenience to those who don't have an account on Blogger.

I strongly believe that if it's important enough to say than you can leave some identifying name.

If you'd like me to respect your comments, I need you to respect my Blog and the people on it.

Determined said...

How strange, although not surprising that you'd get weird anonymous comments on your blog as well.

JQ75 said...

Sol, I know what strange crap you and Kate put up with and that's not for me. If I wanted to be aggravated I'd call my lawyer (no joke).

I've got enough shit in my life, I'm not looking for more. That's why I'm reacting, if it starts, I'm going to cut it off sooner, not later.

Meg Kelso said...

Hey Hon,

I'd leave it there, too. Although it's up to you...I think the letter speaks for itself. You said that I had "surprising insight". Well, a lot of decent, honest people have that. My insight into the writer of that comment is a bitter, angry semi-person who is so very ignorant of the facts of your case that she has no business commenting. (I happen to think it's a wopig)

I think you should remember the advice I gave my kids...don't bother trying to prove yourself or even defend yourself against morons...the people who DO matter know exactly what this asshole it up to.

Trust me, I see through ALL of it. The entire letter is an attempt to manipulate you into feeling badly. Are you sure it isn't someone you know? It's an EXREMELY manipulative person who wrote that trash and if they come back, we'll all take care of her. Right folks?


Remember, you don't discover a new
asshole...you come upon a KNOWN asshole. Bottom line is, you come off looking good and the fool looks like a fool. And, a very stupid one at that.

Love ya!

Meg

Determined said...

"[wopig] is an EXREMELY manipulative person who wrote that trash and if they come back, we'll all take care of her. Right folks? "

RIGHT ON, BLOOD!

Anonymous said...

Hi JQ,

That Anon post is interesting. It does have similarities with how I dealt with the situation with my ex. I completely capitulated giving her the "power" that she was so desperate to have. From that position, I then made myself available at her convenience (ie. not mine - drive an hour each way to look after my son for an hour so she could do something - taking him with my to my night class so she could go out, etc). From that standpoint, I outworked her. I worked in my son's best interests and accepted the abuse being heaped on me (in the early stages, eventually she got tired of it, found other outlets. I only deal with it occasionally now).

Out of it I got a fantastic relationship with my son and a great deal of time with him - including him living with me full time for over a year.

If anon has been in similar shoes to mine - that approach can work. I doubt it is applicable to a large percentage of cases though - in my case, I knew that I would stay involved as she would want to keep yanking the chain to affirm her sense of entitlement.

The other thing that comes out of doing what I did is a huge amount of displaced anger. Perhaps anon is expressing anger that he can't express at the ones who deserve it.

Or maybe he or she is just an asshole.

JQ75 said...

Arby, Thanks for the post, I welcome various ideas, but delivery really is important.

The way anon delivered the message, was unlikely to help anyone who was in your type of situation. Your delivery on the other hand, offers a different view in a helpful way and readers can choose which situation better applies to them. Thank god my situation doesn't apply to everyone, so other situations are good to bring up.

Although, to some degree, I have tried what you said, and she just doesn't go for it. I am the baby sitter of last resort and do take him on a moments notice, forgoing any inconvenience for the opportunity to get more time with my son. The difference is, she is abusing his visitation with me as leverage because it works, she tried lots of other weapons that didn't work. She also has a good knack for manipulating people and has found plenty of play dates & babysitters.

Who knows after she's used all the leverage she can in the final decree, maybe my situation will look more like yours, so I will continue to re-evaluate as things change and look for the opportunity that worked for you.

I'm glad that worked for you, it may yet work for me or other readers. You did very perceptively recognize it for what it was, a manipulative game. But you played it well and came out ahead, I'm glad the inconvenience paid off for you. And I'm glad you stopped by to deliver a message in a useful way.